A VC and a Founder intellectually spar on Vertical Tech & AI, covering the latest news, unpacking in-depth business strategies, and interviewing world-class leaders in the space.

New episodes drop every Wednesday. In this episode, Luke Sophinos and Nic Poulos sit down with Kyle Norton, CRO of Owner, to break down how one of the fastest-growing vertical SaaS companies went from ~$2M → $50M+ ARR in just over three years, and why most founders misunderstand what actually scales GTM in vertical markets.

We cover:

- Why solving the highest-value job in a vertical (not the broadest feature set) creates breakout outcomes

- Toast vs Owner, operations vs revenue, and how targeting a different job reshapes a category

- How to build a GTM “revenue factory” instead of a traditional sales org

- Why ** RevOps, data, and change management** matter more than “hero sellers”

- What most founders get wrong about ACV, speed, and hiring at high-velocity SMB scale

- How founder pattern recognition led Kyle to join Owner at ~$2M ARR, and what he looks for before backing or joining a company

- Why AI is transforming sales leadership (not because of use cases, but because of culture and resourcing)

Whether you’re building in vertical SaaS, vertical AI, B2B sales, or any market where GTM efficiency determines survival, this episode will give you frameworks you can apply immediately.