Private equity is circling the legal industry, and Lucian Pera is helping make sense of what that means for MSO law firms and beyond.

Joining Chris Batz and Howard Rosenberg, Lucian breaks down how management services organizations (MSOs) and alternative business structures (ABSs) are giving outside investors new ways to participate in the economics of law - without running afoul of ethics rules like ABA Rule 5.4.

Lucian makes it clear that these models are tools, not shortcuts. For some firms, an MSO structure may unlock the capital needed for technology, acquisitions, or ambitious growth plans. For others, a traditional loan or internal funding might make more sense. The critical step, he argues, is matching structure to strategy, rather than chasing the latest buzz.

As interest from PE firms and family offices surges, the profession faces a choice: see outside money as a threat, or recognize the opportunities it brings to modernize how law firms operate. Lucian leans toward the latter. Just as medicine and accounting were reshaped by investment, he believes law is in the midst of its own slow-motion revolution where the business side of the profession is finally catching up with reality. For lawyers and investors alike, understanding MSOs, ABSs, and the ethics that govern them is a glimpse into where the legal market is headed next.

Episode Breakdown:

00:00 Meet Lucian Pera

01:04 MSO Law Firms Explained

05:09 Rule 5.4 and Legal Compliance

09:19 Market Trends and Investor Interest

15:45 Which Law Firms Are Using MSOs

18:17 Private Capital: Threat or Opportunity?

25:19 ABS Structures in Law Firms

30:10 ABS vs. MSO: Key Differences

32:10 Future Outlook for Law Firms and PE

Connect with Lucian Pera:

Connect with Lucian on LinkedIn

Lucian’s Website Bio

Connect with Howard Rosenberg:

Connect with Howard on LinkedIn

Howard’s Company Web Profile

Connect with Chris Batz:

Connect with Chris on LinkedIn

Follow Columbus Street on LinkedIn

Columbus Street Website

Podcast production and show notes provided by HiveCast.fm

Mid-sized law firms are facing pressure from every direction. Associates are poached with six-figure pay bumps, partners are stretched thin between billing and management, and specialty practices vanish without succession plans. At the same time, clients expect broader reach and deeper benches than many firms can deliver.

In this episode, host Chris Batz shares what he’s hearing directly from managing partners and executive committee members across the country. He outlines the squeeze mid-sized firms are feeling - lagging organic growth, talent retention challenges, leadership burnout - and the difficult choices leaders are weighing: scale up, go lean, or join a larger platform.

Chris also looks at the emerging role of private equity in law firm ownership and the ripple effects it could have on culture, compensation, and competition. Along the way, he points out steps firms can take now: sharpen strategic vision, invest in leadership and succession, strengthen recruiting systems, and pursue growth through the right mergers or acquisitions.

At its heart, this episode asks a question every firm should confront: how do you stay competitive without exhausting the people who make your firm strong?

Episode Breakdown:

00:00 Why Mid-Sized Law Firms Are Struggling

03:30 Why Talent Keeps Leaving Mid-Sized Firms

04:28 The Leadership Burnout Crisis in Law Firms

07:37 Scenario 1: Losing Lead Counsel Work to Bigger Firms

11:31 Scenario 2: Rainmakers With No Succession Plan

14:04 Billing vs. Leading — Can Firm Leaders Do Both?

18:19 Growth Choices: Lateral Hires, Acquisitions, or Mergers

24:01 Should Mid-Sized Firms Join Larger Platforms?

26:09 The Hidden Cost of Burnout in Firm Leadership

32:17 How Private Equity Is Changing Law Firms

34:18 Strategies for Mid-Sized Firms to Compete

43:48 Key Lessons for Law Firm Leaders

Connect with Chris Batz:

LinkedIn profile: https://www.linkedin.com/in/chrisbatz/

LinkedIn company page: https://www.linkedin.com/company/columbus-street/

Columbus Street website: https://www.columbus-street.com/

Podcast production and show notes provided by HiveCast.fm

Jami Wintz McKeon, Chair of Morgan, Lewis & Bockius LLP, joins Chris Batz and Howard Rosenberg to share her journey from associate to leading one of the world’s largest law firms. She reflects on the moments that shaped her path, including overseeing major integrations, heading the litigation practice, and ultimately stepping into the role of chair.

Jami talks about the personal side of leadership, carrying both the joys and hardships of colleagues, staying connected across a global partnership, and fostering a culture where collaboration comes before credit. She also discusses Morgan, Lewis & Bockius LLP’s approach to expansion, the role of client needs in shaping growth, and how the firm has embraced AI as an opportunity to strengthen client service.

Jami’s advice for fellow and future law firm leaders is straightforward: you have to love the firm, the people, and the responsibility itself. She shares how gratitude and family keep her grounded and why focusing on what’s working is as critical as addressing what isn’t. At its core, this episode is a look at what it means to lead with both strategy and heart in an industry defined by constant change.

Episode Breakdown:

00:00 Jami Wintz McKeon’s Path to Becoming a Law Firm Leader

02:54 Defining Career Turning Points at Morgan, Lewis & Bockius LLP

05:36 Leading with Connection and Caring for Firm Members

08:28 Morgan, Lewis & Bockius LLP Global Growth Strategy

13:40 Artificial Intelligence in Law Firms and Client Service

16:35 Advice for Current and Aspiring Law Firm Leaders

20:20 Staying Grounded Through Gratitude and Family

25:40 Inspiration and Leadership Philosophy

29:38 Looking Ahead: The Future of Law Firm Leadership

Links

Connect with Jami Wintz McKeon:

LinkedIn: https://www.linkedin.com/in/jami-wintz-mckeon-1b993746/

Web bio: https://www.morganlewis.com/bios/jmckeon

Connect with Howard Rosenberg:

LinkedIn profile: https://www.linkedin.com/in/hrosenberg/

Company web profile: https://www.baretzbrunelle.com/howard-rosenberg

Connect with Chris Batz:

LinkedIn Profile: https://www.linkedin.com/in/chrisbatz/

LinkedIn Company page: https://www.linkedin.com/company/columbus-street/

Columbus Street website: https://www.columbus-street.com/

Podcast production and show notes provided by HiveCast.fm