For part 7 of 12 on “What is the Nicene Creed?” we unpack these lines:

For our sake he was crucified under Pontius Pilate;
he suffered death and was buried

On the third day he rose again
in accordance with the Scriptures;

One of the wild things about the Creed is we go right from Jesus’ birth, via Mary, to his death, at the hands of Pontius Pilate. And yet, even wilder still, is that our God in Christ suffered death. The crucifixion – a death used by the Roman Empire to terrify and suppress enslaved people who rebelled – and the resurrection – are at the epicenter of Christian faith. What does it mean that Jesus died this way? What does it mean that on the third day, he rose? We are delighted and amazed to welcome to the podcast the inimitable Rev. Dr. Canon Kelly Brown Douglas, whose enormous work as priest, preacher, teacher, and writer, has long explored these questions.

More about our guest:

The Rev. Canon Kelly Brown Douglas is the Canon Theologian at the Cathedral and Visiting Professor of Theology at Harvard Divinity School for the 2024-25 and 2025-26 academic years. In 2017, she was named Dean of Episcopal Divinity School at Union Theological Seminary in New York City, and in 2019, she was appointed to the Bill and Judith Moyers Chair in Theology at Union. Kelly is considered a leader in the field of womanist theology, racial reconciliation, social justice, and sexuality and the Black church.

From 2017 to 2023, she was Dean of the Episcopal Divinity School at Union Theological Seminary and Professor of Theology. She was named the Bill and Judith Moyers Chair in Theology at Union in November 2019 where she is now Dean emeritus. She served as Interim President of Episcopal Divinity School from 2023-24. During the 2023 fall term, she served as Honorary Professor of Global Theology at Emmanuel Theological College in Liverpool, England.

Ordained as an Episcopal priest in 1983, Douglas currently serves as the Canon Theologian at the Washington National Cathedral and Anglican Communion Canon at Newcastle Cathedral in Newcastle, England.

Prior to Episcopal Divinity School at Union Theological Seminary, she served as Professor of Religion at Goucher College where she held the Susan D. Morgan Professorship of Religion and is now Professor Emeritus. Before Goucher, she was Associate Professor of Theology at Howard University School of Divinity (1987-2001) and Assistant Professor of Religion at Edward Waters College (1986-87). Douglas holds a master’s degree in theology and a PhD in systematic theology from Union.

Douglas is the author of many articles and several books including the 2023 Grawemeyer Award winning book, Resurrection Hope: A Future Where Black Lives Matter. Her academic work has focused on womanist theology, racial justice issues as well as sexuality and the Black church. Her current research interest involves expanding the moral imaginary in fostering a more just future.

Douglas proudly serves on the New York City Homeless Coalition Board and the Public Religion and Research Institute Board.

+++

Like what you hear? We are an entirely crowd-sourced, you-funded project.

SUPPORT US ON PATREON: https://www.patreon.com/AndAlsoWithYouPodcast

There's all kinds of perks including un-aired live episodes, Zoom retreats, and mailbag episodes for our Patreons!

+++

Our Website: https://andalsowithyoupod.com

Our Instagram: https://www.instagram.com/andalsowithyoupodcast/

++++

MERCH: https://www.bonfire.com/store/and-also-with-you-the-podcast/

++++

More about Father Lizzie:

BOOK: https://www.penguinrandomhouse.com/books/762683/god-didnt-make-us-to-hate-us-by-rev-lizzie-mcmanus-dail/

RevLizzie.com

https://www.instagram.com/rev.lizzie/

https://www.tiktok.com/@rev.lizzie

Jubilee Episcopal Church in Austin, TX - JubileeATX.org

++++

More about Mother Laura:

https://www.instagram.com/laura.peaches/

https://www.tiktok.com/@mother_peaches

St. Paul's Episcopal Church in Pittsburgh, PA

++++

Theme music:

"On Our Own Again" by Blue Dot Sessions (www.sessions.blue).

New episodes drop Mondays at 7am EST/6am CST!

For part 6 of 12 on “What is the Nicene Creed?” we unpack these lines:

by the power of the Holy Spirit
he became incarnate from the Virgin Mary,
and was made man

The Virgin Mary is a powerful force in Christian imagination – meaning, whether you venerate her or are suspicious of folks “praying to” her, whether you grew up celebrating the many apparitions of Mary or vaguely only heard her referred to around Christmas, her role in Jesus’ life and our lives communicates what we believe about motherhood, virginity, women, and Jesus’ incarnation. So why is she included in the Creed? What about her presence, consent to bear the Christ child, and reproductive status made her significant enough to be the only human being referenced besides Pontius Pilate? Join Mary devotee (Rev. Lizzie), Mary skeptic (Rev. Laura), and our guest, Mariology expert (Rev. Dr. Amey Victoria Adkins-Jones) as we unpack these questions and more.

More about our guest:

Amey Victoria Adkins-Jones is Assistant Professor of Theology and Africana studies at the Candler School of Theology of Emory University, in Atlanta, Georgia. Adkins-Jones came to Candler from Boston College, where she served as Assistant Professor of Theology and African and African Diaspora Studies. A theologian and scholar of Black religion, she specializes in Mariology, Black feminist and womanist thought, and theological anthropology. A graduate of the University of Virginia and Duke Divinity School, she received her Ph.D. in Religion from Duke University in 2016 with a Certificate in Feminist Theory. She was the first Black woman to graduate from the doctoral program in Christian theology and ethics.

Her first monograph, Immaculate Misconceptions: A Black Mariology (Oxford University Press, June 2025), argues that "Mary is Black," and is a Black feminist theological account of the icon of the Black Madonna and the rise of the global sex trade. She is at work on a second book project, See No Evil, which explores how visual technologies and artificial intelligence impact public perception of violence and Black death, developing a theological framework for Black protest..

Outside of academia, Rev. Dr. Adkins-Jones is an ordained Baptist minister who frequently preaches and teaches around the country, and brings pastoral sensibility to her work centering social justice. She is a practicing birth worker (doula), a trained iconographer, and has a career background in UX Copywriting and Design. She joyfully shares life and builds community with her beloved spouse and four children in Atlanta, Georgia.

Instagram: @tomuchavail, @blackfuturesarchive

Web: adkinsjones.com

+++

Like what you hear? We are an entirely crowd-sourced, you-funded project.

SUPPORT US ON PATREON: https://www.patreon.com/AndAlsoWithYouPodcast

There's all kinds of perks including un-aired live episodes, Zoom retreats, and mailbag episodes for our Patreons!

+++

Our Website: https://andalsowithyoupod.com

Our Instagram: https://www.instagram.com/andalsowithyoupodcast/

++++

MERCH: https://www.bonfire.com/store/and-also-with-you-the-podcast/

++++

More about Father Lizzie:

BOOK: https://www.penguinrandomhouse.com/books/762683/god-didnt-make-us-to-hate-us-by-rev-lizzie-mcmanus-dail/

RevLizzie.com

https://www.instagram.com/rev.lizzie/

https://www.tiktok.com/@rev.lizzie

Jubilee Episcopal Church in Austin, TX - JubileeATX.org

++++

More about Mother Laura:

https://www.instagram.com/laura.peaches/

https://www.tiktok.com/@mother_peaches

St. Paul's Episcopal Church in Pittsburgh, PA

++++

Theme music:

"On Our Own Again" by Blue Dot Sessions (www.sessions.blue).

New episodes drop Mondays at 7am EST/6am CST!

What does it mean that God takes on human flesh?

In our Nicene Creed series we're tackling these next lines:

Lines: Through him all things were made.
For us and for our salvation
he came down from heaven:

And we're talking with dear friend, mentor, and fellow church planter Rev. Lisa Yebuah, the lead pastor of Southeast Raleigh Table. We tackle the myths around the human body being a divine problem, what it means for our God to suffer and live as one of us, and why the incarnation has a robust meaning in our current political, spiritual, and theological landscape.

More about our guest, Rev. Lisa:

Reverend Lisa Yebuah currently serves as the Lead Pastor of the Southeast Raleigh Table, a United Methodist worshipping community located near downtown Raleigh. She’s a 1999 graduate of Wofford College and a 2004 graduate of Duke University Divinity School. What fuels her life in ministry is seeing people become their whole selves, and in turn, witnessing people live like and believe that the world can be collectively marked by liberation.

Reverend Yebuah is deeply invested in her local community, and works alongside organizations engaged in advocacy for affordable housing, a living wage, access to mental wellness resources, and equity in public education. Most would describe Lisa as a glutton for joy, a lover of people and the enneagram, a self-professed party-starter, and a biscuit connoisseur. She also admits to having a slight obsession with “Abbott Elementary” and “The Office,” and hopes that one day 90’s R&B becomes required listening.

+++

Like what you hear? We are an entirely crowd-sourced, you-funded project.

SUPPORT US ON PATREON: https://www.patreon.com/AndAlsoWithYouPodcast

There's all kinds of perks including un-aired live episodes, Zoom retreats, and mailbag episodes for our Patreons!

+++

Our Website: https://andalsowithyoupod.com

Our Instagram: https://www.instagram.com/andalsowithyoupodcast/

++++

MERCH: https://www.bonfire.com/store/and-also-with-you-the-podcast/

++++

More about Father Lizzie:

BOOK: https://www.penguinrandomhouse.com/books/762683/god-didnt-make-us-to-hate-us-by-rev-lizzie-mcmanus-dail/

RevLizzie.com

https://www.instagram.com/rev.lizzie/

https://www.tiktok.com/@rev.lizzie

Jubilee Episcopal Church in Austin, TX - JubileeATX.org

++++

More about Mother Laura:

https://www.instagram.com/laura.peaches/

https://www.tiktok.com/@mother_peaches

St. Paul's Episcopal Church in Pittsburgh, PA

++++

Theme music:

"On Our Own Again" by Blue Dot Sessions (www.sessions.blue).

New episodes drop Mondays at 7am EST/6am CST!