Welcome to Bar Student to Barrister, the podcast on yourjourney into pupillage, and beyond into the early years of practice at the Bar, with Chris Kessling, Jody Klaire and our wonderful guest Bibi Badejo.

Bibi was called to the Bar in 2005 and practises from 4PB specialising in family law. She is a Bencher at Inner Temple, an accredited advocacy trainer and the Criminal Course Director of the 2025 Keble Dutton Course. She is the founder of The Advocacy Coach, and host of The Advocacy Podcast providing practical advice for experienced trial lawyers.

In this episode, Bibi shares her journey to becoming abarrister and her insights into the world of advocacy. She discusses the importance of advocacy training, the difference between coaching and training, and how to adapt techniques for different levels of experience. Bibi emphasises the role of self-awareness in advocacy and the impact of her advocacy podcast, where she explores various themes and techniques with expert guests. She also provides practical advice for those starting their advocacy journey, highlighting the importance of preparation and finding one's own voice.

“If everyone could just realise that … whatever accent thatyou’ve got or background that you come from, you just need to be the best you, that your only competition is yourself and let’s develop that.”

Thank you for joining us. We hope you enjoy this episode.

MORE INFORMATION

Bibi Chambers profile https://www.4pb.com/barristers/bibi-badejo/

Bibi on LinkedIn https://www.linkedin.com/in/bibi-badejo/

4PB https://www.4pb.com/

The Advocacy Podcast https://www.theadvocacypodcast.com/

The Advocacy Coach https://www.theadvocacycoach.com/

The Advocacy Clinic https://www.theadvocacycoach.com/clinic

The Hampel Method of Advocacy Training https://www.icca.ac.uk/post-qualification-training/cpd/advocacy-training/the-hampel-method/

Cross-Examination:Science and Techniques, By Larry Pozner and Roger J. Dodd https://www.doddlawclinic.com/books#cross-exam-science-tech

Point Made, How to Write Like the Nation's Top Advocates, byRoss Guberman https://global.oup.com/academic/product/point-made-9780199943852?cc=gb&lang=en&

Turning Points at Trial: Great Lawyers Share Secrets,Strategies and Skills, by Shane Read https://www.abebooks.co.uk/9780985027117/Turning-Points-Trial-Great-Lawyers-0985027118/plp

CONTACT

Email: barstudent2barristerpodcast@gmail.com

Instagram https://www.instagram.com/iccabar/

LinkedIn https://www.linkedin.com/school/the-inns-of-court-college-of-advocacy/

Website https://www.icca.ac.uk/icca-bar-course/bar-student-to-barrister-podcast/

INDEPENDENCE

Registration on the ICCA Bar Course confers no advantage inrelation to Inns’ scholarships or awards, Inns’ membership, Qualifying Sessions or Call to the Bar. For more information see the Policy on Independence between the Inns of Court and the ICCA.

COPYRIGHT

Inns of Court College of Advocacy (part of the COIC) © 2025.All rights reserved.

In this episode, we meet Donna O’Leary, AI Consultant at DOL Consultancy, a Course Designer and Lecturer at the Law Society of Ireland, and an Irish and UK-qualified solicitor.

AI is something which will have a significant impact on allof us, which is why we were so pleased that Donna recently gave a lecture to ICCA Bar Course students, recorded at the Inner Temple, and entitled ‘AI and the Legal Profession’.

What does AI literacy actually mean?

Why have hallucinations become a big problem for the legalprofession?

How do you use AI in the right way?

You will hear much of the lecture in this episode, in whichDonna explains the AI legal framework; AI terminology uses and limitations; how AI can assist your daily work, and your professional obligations when using it.

Introduced by Lynda Gibbs KC (Hon), Dean of the ICCA, we hope you enjoy this episode.

If you do, please like and subscribe for more.

MORE INFORMATION

Donna on LinkedIn https://www.linkedin.com/in/donna-o-leary-179583a2/

New guidance on generative AI for the Bar (Bar Council) https://www.barcouncil.org.uk/resource/new-guidance-on-generative-ai-for-the-bar.html

Judicial AI guidance https://www.judiciary.uk/guidance-and-resources/artificial-intelligence-ai-judicial-guidance-october-2025/

R(Ayinde) v London Borough of Haringey [2025] EWHC 1383(Admin) https://www.judiciary.uk/wp-content/uploads/2025/06/Ayinde-v-London-Borough-of-Haringey-and-Al-Haroun-v-Qatar-National-Bank.pdf

Bar Code of Conduct (Part 2 of the BSB Handbook) https://www.barstandardsboard.org.uk/the-bsb-handbook.html?part=E3FF76D3-9538-4B97-94C02111664E5709&audience=&csrfToken=&q=

CONTACT

Email: barstudent2barristerpodcast@gmail.com

Instagramhttps://www.instagram.com/iccabar/

LinkedIn https://www.linkedin.com/school/the-inns-of-court-college-of-advocacy/

Website https://www.icca.ac.uk/icca-bar-course/bar-student-to-barrister-podcast/

INDEPENDENCE

Registration on the ICCA Bar Course confers no advantage inrelation to Inns’ scholarships or awards, Inns’ membership, Qualifying Sessions or Call to the Bar. For more information see the Policy on Independence between the Inns of Court andthe ICCA.

COPYRIGHT

Inns of Court College of Advocacy (part of the COIC) © 2025. All rights reserved.

In this episode, meet Anu Lal, called to the Bar by the Middle Temple in 2023 and a tenant at Fourteen Chambers, a leading London-based family law set.

From taking part in a mock trial competition at school, Anu shares her inspiring journey to becoming a barrister, focusing on her experiences in family law, the emotional challenges of the profession, and the importance of preparation, research and resilience.

Offering valuable advice for aspiring barristers. Anu emphasises the significance of understanding the realities of a legal career and the need for self-care amidst the challenges of practice.

“I always knew I wanted to be a barrister since I was doingmy GCSEs … My school took part in the National Bar Mock Trial Competition … a small group of us were mentored by a criminal barrister … and readied us for this competition, and that was it.”

“I really fell in love with the idea of representing people,of speaking for ordinary folk and people from all walks of life …”

“There is no getting round being properly prepared... There’s no cutting corners to that hard work and that graft that you’ve got to put in.”

“My personal calendar has got everything, it’s got my workand all sorts of things. And I colour-code things... And I look at that calendar and I think, ‘Is there enough of a rainbow there?’ And that’s a great first catch for me to see if I’m having as well-rounded a life as I could be.”

"Life is tough and fun is very important."

Hosted by Chris Kessling, barrister and Vice Dean of the Inns of Court College of Advocacy (ICCA).

Thank you for joining us for this episode of Bar Student to Barrister. Please like/subscribe and we look forward to you joining us every Friday.

INFORMATION

Anu on LinkedIn https://www.linkedin.com/in/anu-lal-6b9652a8/

Anu’s chambers profile https://fourteen.co.uk/our-people/our-barristers/anu-lal/

Fourteen Chambers https://fourteen.co.uk/

CONTACT

Email: barstudent2barristerpodcast@gmail.com

Instagram https://www.instagram.com/iccabar/

LinkedIn https://www.linkedin.com/school/the-inns-of-court-college-of-advocacy/

Website https://www.icca.ac.uk/icca-bar-course/bar-student-to-barrister-podcast/

INDEPENDENCE

Registration on the ICCA Bar Course confers no advantage inrelation to Inns’ scholarships or awards, Inns’ membership, Qualifying Sessions or Call to the Bar. For more information see the Policy on Independence between the Inns of Court andthe ICCA.

COPYRIGHT

Inns of Court College of Advocacy (part of the COIC) © 2025. All rights reserved.

In this episode of Bar Student to Barrister we hear from Sam Grimley, ICCA Bar Course graduate, called to the Bar by Gray’s Inn in 2025 and now a tenant at One Essex Court, a pre-eminent commercial set of barristers’ chambers in London, and The Lawyer Chambers of the Year 2025.

Sam had a very successful career in the music industry as a guitarist and keyboard player. In fact, he knew from the age of 6 that music was for him. He was a session musician at Ronnie Scott’s and worked with many artists including TomJones, Ed Sheeran and Jessie J.

As so often happens in life, he ultimately followed adifferent path which took him to the Bar, including taking a GDL, a BCL at the University of Oxford, completing the ICCA Bar Course and then pupillage, followed by tenancy, at One Essex Court.

Sam is now a barrister specialising in commercial, competition and intellectual property litigation, with a particular interest in media and entertainment disputes.

“… I’ve come from a completely different world. I mean aboutfive years ago I had never even heard of this world. So to be right in the beating heart of it now feels very strange, but I’m also utterly delighted.”

“… it’s doing a good job at whatever you're given and being personable and a good member of a team that really helps anyone in any industry.”

“ … get as much tailored advice as you can on your own performance, on your own strengths and weaknesses and take that on board, and try and improve off the back of it.”

“I'd say the headline thing that I had to learn was the importance of clarity and actually simplicity.”

“There is something extra that you get from an intense training process that is actually the product of the intensity. And the thing you get is confidence.”

And as Sam says, “Go for the run!” Listen on for exactlywhat this means.

This is Sam’s story to the Intellectual Property Bar.

Please follow/subscribe and we look forward to seeing youagain next Friday, with yet more helpful information and personal accounts to help and guide you on your journey to the Bar.

INFORMATION

Sam on LinkedIn https://www.linkedin.com/in/sam-grimley-47105224/

One Essex Court https://www.oeclaw.co.uk/

Sam’s Chambers’ website profile https://www.oeclaw.co.uk/barristers/profile/sam-grimley

The Pop Star and the Prophet (BBC Sounds) https://www.bbc.co.uk/sounds/play/b069xcys

CONTACT

Email: barstudent2barristerpodcast@gmail.com

Instagram https://www.instagram.com/iccabar/

LinkedIn https://www.linkedin.com/school/the-inns-of-court-college-of-advocacy/

Website https://www.icca.ac.uk/icca-bar-course/bar-student-to-barrister-podcast/

INDEPENDENCE

Registration on the ICCA Bar Course confers no advantage inrelation to Inns’ scholarships or awards, Inns’ membership, Qualifying Sessions or Call to the Bar. For more information see the Policyon Independence between the Inns of Court and the ICCA.

COPYRIGHT

Inns of Court Collegeof Advocacy (part of the COIC) © 2025. All rights reserved.

Welcome to Episode 3 of Bar Student to Barrister. In this week’s episode we have something special, a presentation given to ICCA Bar Course students on 13 October 2025, entitled ‘Failing Forwards - Building Resilience for a Career at the Bar of England & Wales’

In this episode you will hear from three professionals with fascinating insights into what resilience really means on your journey to the Bar.

Tony Charles is the Director of Education at Gray’s Inn, a senior leader with a broad range of experience across all aspects ofeducation and training.

Saara Idelbi is a barrister at 39 Essex Chambers, a legal professional, strategic advisor, and effective advocate recognised by Legal 500 as a ‘Leading Junior’ in the areas of Administrative Law and Human Rights, Court ofProtection and Community Care, and Inquests and Inquiries.

John-Paul Fitzgibbon is a Criminal and Public International LawBarrister, Naval Officer and Commander.

Three quotes from Tony Charles perhaps best set the scene for what you are about to hear::

“Failure and resilience are inextricably linked and frequentlymisunderstood.”

“Failure, success, learning and resilience are all part of the sameequation and that’s really what we are going to focus on today.”

“The setbacks are not interruptions to success, they are part of its fabric.”

As Tony also says, ‘“Our message today is a positive one about the journey you are on and it’s a positive one about the journey ahead.”

We hope you enjoy this episode, and a huge thank you to Tony, Saara and John Paul for giving their time to provide such invaluable insights.

Please follow/subscribe and we look forward to seeing you again next Friday, with yet more helpful information and personal accounts to help and guide you on your journey to the Bar.

INFORMATION

Tony Charles - LinkedIn https://www.linkedin.com/in/tony-charles-7a8bb383/

Saara Idelbi - LinkedIn https://www.linkedin.com/in/saara-idelbi/

John-Paul Fitzgibbon - LinkedIn https://www.linkedin.com/in/johnpaulf/

39 Essex Chambers https://www.39essex.com/

Advocatr https://advocatr.com/

What I learned from 100 days of rejection (Ted Talks) https://www.ted.com/talks/jia_jiang_what_i_learned_from_100_days_of_rejection

CONTACT

Email: barstudent2barristerpodcast@gmail.com

Instagram https://www.instagram.com/iccabar/

LinkedIn https://www.linkedin.com/school/the-inns-of-court-college-of-advocacy/

Website https://www.icca.ac.uk/icca-bar-course/bar-student-to-barrister-podcast/

INDEPENDENCE

Registration on the ICCA Bar Course confers no advantage in relation to Inns’ scholarships or awards, Inns’ membership, Qualifying Sessions or Call to the Bar. For more information see the Policy on Independence between the Inns of Court and the ICCA.

COPYRIGHT

Inns of Court College of Advocacy (part of the COIC) © 2025. All rights reserved.

Welcome to Episode 2 of Bar Student to Barrister. In this week’s episode we meet Gaurav Sachanandani, now in his early years of practice at Burnell Chambers, situated on Middle Temple Lane in London.

From starting his law degree at the age of 17, we follow Gaurav through Bar training, pupillage and into his early years as a specialist tax barrister, and even why studying does not always stop when you embark on full-time professional practice.

And what else do we discover on the way?

First, Gaurav dreamed of becoming an astronomer before even thinking about the law.

And what excited his interest in becoming a lawyer? For that you’ll have to listen, but it’s something we suspect you’ll hear more than a few times in this podcast series, at least from those who are prepared to admit it.

The complexity and intellectual challenge of tax law, and the ambition to build his practice as a respected expert, is perhaps at the heart of what drives Gaurav, but you will also discover that he is positive, enthusiastic, committed, determined, and no stranger to hard work.

And why is ‘cracking the code’ used in the title of this episode? Again, you can find out before too long, but it’s something that Gaurav has been doing in multiple ways as he has pursued his ambition to become a barrister.

In this episode you will also hear how Gaurav approached applying for pupillage to specialist tax and chancery chambers, what written exercises he was asked to carry out, and what happened during the interview process.

There is also a cautionary tale for all prospective barristers – what might happen at the end of a pupillage interview when you are asked if you have any questions? Beware the danger zone! But as we find out, sometimes things happen for a reason.

Gaurav also tells us what happens when you arrive on Day 1 of pupillage in a tax chambers, as well as how to cope when technical failure greets you in your pupillage professional ethics exam.

And finally, even though he is a practising barrister, does Gaurav own a wig and gown? Find out in this episode.

This is Gaurav’s journey to the specialist tax Bar. We hope you enjoy this episode. Please follow/subscribe on your podcast platform for future episodes.

INFORMATION

Burnell Chambers https://burnellchambers.co.uk/

Gaurav’s profile https://burnellchambers.co.uk/barristers/gaurav-sachanandani/

Gaurav on LinkedIn https://www.linkedin.com/in/gaurav-sachanandani-73394a230/

CONTACT

Email: barstudent2barristerpodcast@gmail.com

Instagram https://www.instagram.com/iccabar/

LinkedIn https://www.linkedin.com/school/the-inns-of-court-college-of-advocacy/

Website https://www.icca.ac.uk/icca-bar-course/bar-student-to-barrister-podcast/

INDEPENDENCE

Registration on the ICCA Bar Course confers no advantage inrelation to Inns’ scholarships or awards, Inns’ membership, Qualifying Sessions or Call to the Bar. For more information see the Policy on Independence between the Inns of Court and the ICCA.

COPYRIGHT

Inns of Court College of Advocacy (part of the COIC) © 2025. All rights reserved.

Inns of Court College ofAdvocacy (part of the COIC) © 2025. All rights reserved.