Jonathan Greene sits down with Joe Rinderknecht, multifamily investor and co-founder of Cowboy Capital, to explore how he built a real estate portfolio by staying curious, solving problems, and building long-term relationships with owners. Joe shares how he broke into multifamily with seller financing, how he used subject-to strategies to help owners avoid foreclosure, and why empathy has become foundational to his investing style. Jonathan and Joe also explore the lessons learned from managing smaller properties, scaling into larger ones, and developing the operational discipline needed to create durable performance.

Throughout the conversation, Joe explains how he approached deal structure early in his career, the importance of understanding seller pain points, and how his "word is bond" philosophy continues to shape the way he raises capital and works with investors now. He also reflects on partnership dynamics, risk tolerance, and the evolution from doing everything yourself to delegating, documenting, and building systems that allow a team to grow.

Listeners will walk away with a grounded reminder that momentum in real estate often comes from doing the right thing—helping people, thinking long-term, and being willing to learn from every deal, no matter the size.

• How Joe got into multifamily through seller financing and why creative structures helped him get started without traditional barriers.

• The subject-to foreclosure story that shaped Joe's understanding of empathy, negotiation, and long-term relationship building.

• Why smaller properties became Joe's training ground for learning asset management, communication, and systems.

• How Joe's risk tolerance shifted over time and how partnership dynamics supported that growth.

• The importance of documentation, checklists, and processes as a business scales.

• Why Joe believes relationships—not deals—are the real foundation of a sustainable real estate career.

If you enjoy the show, please follow Zen and the Art of Real Estate Investing on Apple Podcasts and leave a rating and review. It helps other listeners discover these conversations and supports the show's growth.

Connect with Joe:

Website: https://cowboycapital.us/

Youtube: https://www.youtube.com/@cowboycapital.us2025

Facebook: http://facebook.com/joe.rinderknecht

Instagram: https://www.instagram.com/joe_rinder

LinkedIn: https://www.linkedin.com/in/joerinderknecht/

Connect with Jonathan:

Website - www.streamlined.properties

YouTube - www.youtube.com/c/JonathanGreeneRE/videos

Instagram - www.instagram.com/trustgreene

Instagram - www.instagram.com/streamlinedproperties

Zillow - www.zillow.com/profile/streamlinen​j

Bigger Pockets - www.biggerpockets.com/users/jonathangreene

Facebook - www.facebook.com/streamlinedproperties

Email - info@streamlined.properties

This episode was produced by Outlier Audio.

On this week's episode of Zen and the Art of Real Estate Investing, Jonathan Greene sits down with interior designer Marcy Sagel, founder and principal of MSA Interiors, a nationally recognized commercial design firm specializing in multifamily, senior housing, healthcare, and large-scale developments. They explore how smart design decisions can dramatically impact renter experience, tenant retention, and net operating income—often without blowing up the budget. Marcy shares the story of how a single project with a supportive architect-mentor evolved into a portfolio of large-scale multifamily and healthcare work across the country.

From there, Jonathan and Marcy dive into the details that operators often overlook: how lobby art and amenities shape first impressions, why designers insist on holding the spec once materials are chosen, and how transparency around product pricing can protect both developers and residents. Marcy explains why functionality is just as important as aesthetics—things like where the sofa and TV actually fit, whether you can get a couch down the hallway, and how closet space, bathrooms, lighting, and unit layouts influence who wants to live in a building and how much they're willing to pay.

They also talk about how COVID changed amenity expectations, from coworking and Zoom rooms to package rooms, cold storage for grocery delivery, pet wash stations, and creative vending concepts for residents. Marcy highlights the unique demands of healthcare and senior living design, including memory care safety, assisted living functionality, and the importance of natural light and outdoor access in driving wellness. Throughout the conversation, she comes back to one central idea: if owners think about residents first and involve a design team early, they can future-proof their properties, reduce turnover, and outcompete newer projects for years to come.

• How Marcy transitioned from residential design into large-scale multifamily, healthcare, and senior living projects with the help of an architect-mentor.

• Why involving an interior designer early in a project can save money, prevent costly change orders, and create a cohesive, long-lasting design.

• Practical ways to upgrade B-class and affordable communities—on a HUD-constrained or tight construction budget—without sacrificing aesthetics.

• The design details that residents care about most: closet size, bathroom finishes, in-unit laundry, lighting, circulation, and furniture-friendly layouts.

• How COVID reshaped amenity programming with coworking areas, Zoom rooms, package rooms, cold storage, pet amenities, and flexible vendor spaces.

• The role of design in building community, reducing turnover, and making residents—and their families in senior living—feel safe, connected, and at home.

If you enjoy the show, please follow Zen and the Art of Real Estate Investing on Apple Podcasts and leave a rating and review. It helps other listeners discover these conversations and supports the show's growth.

Connect with Marcy:

Website: https://msainteriors.com/

Instagram: https://www.instagram.com/MSAInteriors

LinkedIn: https://www.linkedin.com/in/MarcySagel/

Connect with Jonathan:

Website - www.streamlined.properties

YouTube - www.youtube.com/c/JonathanGreeneRE/videos

Instagram - www.instagram.com/trustgreene

Instagram - www.instagram.com/streamlinedproperties

Zillow - www.zillow.com/profile/streamlinen​j

Bigger Pockets - www.biggerpockets.com/users/jonathangreene

Facebook - www.facebook.com/streamlinedproperties

Email - info@streamlined.properties

This episode was produced by Outlier Audio.

Jonathan Greene delivers a solo milestone Episode 300, reflecting on what real estate investors really need to succeed in 2026. Drawing on 300 episodes' worth of conversations and ten key questions generated by ChatGPT, he walks through interest rates, debt and recapitalization risk, local supply and demand, asset selection, and how to think about the next phase of the market rather than trying to predict it.

He shares how he's approaching the year ahead himself—doubling down on being an "asset hunter," investing as an LP in multifamily syndications, eyeing self-storage and Main Street mixed-use, and planning to add a short-term rental in upstate New York. Along the way, Jonathan talks about meetups, possible future retreats, and long-term plans to bring real estate education to younger generations, all while emphasizing the importance of daily research in your buy box over obsessing about national headlines.

Listeners will hear why mindset and mental health come before any big investment move, how to vet operators in syndications, and why diversification by geography, asset type, and vehicle can help you weather whatever 2026 brings. Jonathan closes with reflections on legacy, his parents' influence, and what it means to build a real estate portfolio that actually supports a meaningful life.

In this episode, you will hear:

• Why Jonathan treats interest rates as just one part of the deal calculation—and why waiting for "3% again" is a losing strategy.

• How to focus on your local buy box, study hot sheets, and spot the path of progress instead of obsessing over national housing headlines.

• The asset classes and strategies he's most interested in for 2026, from multifamily syndications and short-term rentals to self-storage and Main Street mixed-use.

• Why your mental health, personal life stability, and partner alignment are non-negotiables before making major investment decisions.

• How he uses tools like ChatGPT and data to research regulations, stress-test opportunities, and build more resilient, diversified portfolios without outsourcing his judgment.

Follow and Review
If you enjoy the show, please follow Zen and the Art of Real Estate Investing on Apple Podcasts and leave a rating and review. It helps other listeners discover these conversations and supports the show's growth.

Supporting Resources

Connect with Jonathan:

Website - www.streamlined.properties

YouTube - www.youtube.com/c/JonathanGreeneRE/videos

Instagram - www.instagram.com/trustgreene

Instagram - www.instagram.com/streamlinedproperties

Zillow - www.zillow.com/profile/streamlinen​j

Bigger Pockets - www.biggerpockets.com/users/jonathangreene

Facebook - www.facebook.com/streamlinedproperties

Email - info@streamlined.properties

This episode was produced by Outlier Audio.

On this episode of Zen and the Art of Real Estate Investing, Jonathan welcomes Benjamin Kanner, CEO and co-founder of 3V Infrastructure, a company focused on delivering long-term, scalable EV charging solutions for multifamily portfolios. With a background spanning commercial real estate, renewable energy project finance, and multiple startups, Ben brings a uniquely holistic view of how electrification intersects with property ownership and investor demand. His company's model—installing, owning, and operating EV chargers at no cost to property owners—creates a compelling new amenity for renters while helping owners stay ahead of rapidly shifting consumer expectations.

Throughout the conversation, Ben and Jonathan discuss the accelerating adoption of electric vehicles, why multifamily properties sit at the center of this transition, and the economic forces shaping the need for reliable, long-dwell charging infrastructure. Ben explains the cost drivers behind EV ownership, how modular battery technology is evolving, and why Level 2 charging is the most practical option for home-based needs. He also breaks down how 3V underwrites utilization, diversifies risk across large portfolios, and helps property owners increase rents and tenant satisfaction—all without capital outlay.

Listeners will gain a deeper understanding of how EV charging impacts NOI, what's really happening with power demand, why used EV markets will expand rapidly, and how owners can prepare their buildings for the next decade of transportation needs. Whether you're an LP, a multifamily operator, or simply curious about electrification, this episode highlights the strategic advantage of early adoption.

• Why EV adoption has crossed a national inflection point and what that means for multifamily owners.

• How 3V Infrastructure finances, installs, and maintains EV chargers with no upfront cost to operators.

• The economics of EV ownership—including maintenance, fueling costs, and battery modularity.

• Why Level 2 charging is ideal for long-dwell environments like apartment communities.

• The role of data, utilization modeling, and EV "rent rolls" in determining charger counts.

• How electrification, grid demand, and infrastructure investment will shape the next decade of CRE.

If you enjoy the show, please follow Zen and the Art of Real Estate Investing on Apple Podcasts and leave a rating and review. It helps other listeners discover these conversations and supports the show's growth.

Connect with Benjamin:

Website: https://www.3vinfrastructure.com/

Connect with Jonathan:

Website - www.streamlined.properties

YouTube - www.youtube.com/c/JonathanGreeneRE/videos

Instagram - www.instagram.com/trustgreene

Instagram - www.instagram.com/streamlinedproperties

Zillow - www.zillow.com/profile/streamlinen​j

Bigger Pockets - www.biggerpockets.com/users/jonathangreene

Facebook - www.facebook.com/streamlinedproperties

Email - info@streamlined.properties

This episode was produced by Outlier Audio.

On this episode of Zen and the Art of Real Estate Investing, Jonathan sits down with capital-raising expert and Managing Director of M1 Real Capital Marcin Drozdz. With a track record of raising nine figures across multiple funds and mentoring over a thousand operators through his M1 Inner Circle, Marcin brings a clear, principled perspective to building long-term investor relationships, structuring funds, and understanding how capital really moves in today's marketplace. His journey from an immigrant childhood in communist Poland to raising hundreds of millions in U.S. real estate adds valuable context to how he approaches trust, process, and scale.

Throughout the conversation, Jonathan and Marcin break down the realities of capital raising across economic cycles, the importance of people-first frameworks, and how new investors should think about syndications versus funds. Marcin shares his 3P method—people, process, portfolio—and explains why most syndicators get this backwards. He also dives into how credibility is built over years, not online clips, and why understanding investor pain points is critical to positioning the right opportunities for the right individuals.

Listeners will gain insight into how large fund managers think, how to evaluate deals through the lens of return of capital before return on capital, and how authentic relationship-building still drives success—even in a social media–driven world. Whether you're raising capital, investing passively, or trying to understand the current commercial cycle, this episode offers a grounded, experienced perspective.

• Marcin's 3P capital-raising framework and why people—not deals—must come first.

• The value of mentorship and apprenticing before raising capital on your own.

• How funds differ from single-asset syndications and when each structure makes sense.

• The importance of protecting downside risk and prioritizing return of capital.

• Why authentic long-term content—not hype—drives investor trust.

• How today's debt wall may create a unique acquisition window in multifamily.

If you enjoy the show, please follow Zen and the Art of Real Estate Investing on Apple Podcasts and leave a rating and review. It helps other listeners discover these conversations and supports the show's growth.

Connect with Marcin

Website: https://www.marcindrozdz.com/

Youtube: https://www.youtube.com/@therealmarcindrozdz

Facebook: https://www.facebook.com/realmarcindrozdz

Instagram: https://www.instagram.com/realmarcindrozdz/

LinkedIn: https://www.linkedin.com/in/marcindrozdz/

Special Link: https://www.marcindrozdz.ca/optin-podcastm1?utm_source=zenandtheartofrei

Connect with Jonathan:

Website - www.streamlined.properties

YouTube - www.youtube.com/c/JonathanGreeneRE/videos

Instagram - www.instagram.com/trustgreene

Instagram - www.instagram.com/streamlinedproperties

Zillow - www.zillow.com/profile/streamlinen​j

Bigger Pockets - www.biggerpockets.com/users/jonathangreene

Facebook - www.facebook.com/streamlinedproperties

Email - info@streamlined.properties

This episode was produced by Outlier Audio.

On this episode of Zen and the Art of Real Estate Investing, Jonathan welcomes back multifamily investor, financial educator, and newly certified money coach Gino Barbaro. Known for his work with Jake & Gino and his educational focus on long-term wealth, Gino joins Jonathan to unpack the deeper connection between money, mindset, family values, and building a legacy. The discussion moves beyond real estate strategy into the emotional and psychological frameworks that shape financial behavior across generations.

As the conversation unfolds, Jonathan and Gino explore how childhood experiences influence adult money patterns, why transparency within families matters, and how parents can introduce financial literacy without pressure or fear. Gino also breaks down his philosophy on treating households like businesses, teaching kids financial stewardship, and why thinking like your own "family office" can radically change long-term outcomes.

Listeners will come away with a clearer understanding of how to build a mindful, value-driven approach to wealth that supports both personal growth and multigenerational stability. Whether you're raising kids, investing for the first time, or rethinking your relationship with money, this episode offers practical wisdom and grounded inspiration.

• How early memories form unconscious money patterns that affect adult decision-making.

• Why teaching kids autonomy, financial literacy, and values matters more than pushing real estate.

• The importance of transparency around wealth, planning, and tax strategy within families.

• Gino's framework for thinking like a "family office" at any net worth level.

• How real estate fits into long-term legacy building beyond just assets and cash flow.

• Why aligning values, mindset, and financial systems creates more stable generational wealth.

If you enjoy the show, please follow Zen and the Art of Real Estate Investing on Apple Podcasts and leave a rating and review. It helps other listeners discover these conversations and supports the show's growth.

Connect with Gino:

Website: https://barbaro360.com

Youtube: https://www.youtube.com/@barbaro-360

Facebook: https://www.facebook.com/JoinGinosFamily

LinkedIn: https://www.linkedin.com/in/gino-barbaro-03973b4b/

Connect with Jonathan:

Website - www.streamlined.properties

YouTube - www.youtube.com/c/JonathanGreeneRE/videos

Instagram - www.instagram.com/trustgreene

Instagram - www.instagram.com/streamlinedproperties

Zillow - www.zillow.com/profile/streamlinen​j

Bigger Pockets - www.biggerpockets.com/users/jonathangreene

Facebook - www.facebook.com/streamlinedproperties

Email - info@streamlined.properties

This episode was produced by Outlier Audio.

Jonathan Greene welcomes interior designer, real estate investor, and New York State licensed agent Mackenzie Grate to the show for a conversation about design-forward investing, building a rental portfolio from scratch, and choosing the right strategy for your lifestyle. Mackenzie, known as "Mac of All Trades," shares how she shifted from working as an assistant principal to becoming a full-time investor and designer, starting with her first long-term rental in Kingston and eventually expanding into short-term rentals, multifamily properties, and design consulting.

Jonathan and Mackenzie explore mindset, risk tolerance, and how every investor evolves over time. Mackenzie explains why being clear about your investor identity matters, how to avoid overspending on design choices, and why community and local knowledge are essential for success. Her experience highlights the balance between creativity, practicality, and long-term planning.

Listeners will learn what it truly takes to build a sustainable portfolio, from selecting the right first property to managing guest expectations and making design decisions that enhance both functionality and profitability. Mackenzie's combination of design expertise and hands-on investing experience offers thoughtful guidance for anyone looking to build a portfolio that performs.

• How Mackenzie bought her first long-term rental while working full-time in education

• The most common design mistakes investors make and how to avoid unnecessary spending

• Why knowing your investor identity should guide every strategic decision

• How local market knowledge and relationships support short-term rental success

• What realistic scaling looks like for new investors

• Why your first property does not need to be your dream property

If you enjoy the show, please follow Zen and the Art of Real Estate Investing on Apple Podcasts and leave a rating and review. It helps other listeners discover these conversations and supports the show's growth.

Connect with Mackenzie:

Website: www.moatinteriordesigns.com

Instagram: @Mackofalltrades

Connect with Jonathan:

Website - www.streamlined.properties

YouTube - www.youtube.com/c/JonathanGreeneRE/videos

Instagram - www.instagram.com/trustgreene

Instagram - www.instagram.com/streamlinedproperties

Zillow - www.zillow.com/profile/streamlinen​j

Bigger Pockets - www.biggerpockets.com/users/jonathangreene

Facebook - www.facebook.com/streamlinedproperties

Email - info@streamlined.properties

This episode was produced by Outlier Audio.

Jonathan Greene sits down with Chris Grenzig, founder of JAG Property Management and JAG Capital Partners, a vertically integrated multifamily firm focused on Jacksonville and Orlando. Chris walks through his evolution from working at Toro to moving markets, taking on a 16-unit value-add deal, and learning property and construction management by doing. He and Jonathan explore what it's been like to operate through COVID, explosive rent growth, and then a sharp pullback in Florida.

As the conversation unfolds, Chris breaks down how he approached that first 16-unit acquisition, the role his prior asset management experience played, and why local market knowledge became his unfair advantage. He speaks candidly about Florida's recent "perfect storm" of falling rents, rising insurance, and higher interest rates, and how those forces have impacted his portfolio and his investors. Chris and Jonathan also get tactical on out-of-state investing, the limits of BRRRR and flipping in today's environment, and the differences between property management and true asset management.

Listeners will come away with a grounded understanding of what it really looks like to buy, renovate, refinance, and hold in a shifting market—and how to keep investor trust when the numbers don't go as planned. Chris's experience navigating tough cycles in Florida offers real-world lessons on conservative underwriting, staying honest with investors, and building a property management business that serves both accidental landlords and more sophisticated owners.

• How Chris transitioned from working at Toro to moving to Jacksonville and taking on his own 16-unit value-add property

• Why he chose to self-manage and oversee construction on a deal he'd never managed at that level before

• How COVID, rent drops, rising insurance, and interest rate hikes combined into a "perfect storm" for Florida multifamily

• Why local market knowledge and conservative underwriting matter more than ever in today's environment

• The realities and limitations of flipping and BRRRR strategies in higher-rate, higher-cost markets

• What investors should look for in a property manager—and why asset management and property management are not the same thing

If you enjoy the show, please follow Zen and the Art of Real Estate Investing on Apple Podcasts and leave a rating and review. It helps other listeners discover these conversations and supports the show's growth.

Connect with Chris Grenzig:

Website: https://orlandoproperty.management/

Facebook: https://www.facebook.com/chris.grenzig

Instagram: https://instagram.com/chris.grenzig

LinkedIn: https://www.linkedin.com/in/chris-grenzig/

Connect with Jonathan:

Website - www.streamlined.properties

YouTube - www.youtube.com/c/JonathanGreeneRE/videos

Instagram - www.instagram.com/trustgreene

Instagram - www.instagram.com/streamlinedproperties

Zillow - www.zillow.com/profile/streamlinen​j

Bigger Pockets - www.biggerpockets.com/users/jonathangreene

Facebook - www.facebook.com/streamlinedproperties

Email - info@streamlined.properties

This episode was produced by Outlier Audio.