Manu Orssaud is the Chief Marketing Officer of Duolingo, where he is responsible for building the brand and driving user growth globally. Prior to Duolingo, Manu led Global Marketing Strategy at Spotify and one of the things he was was responsible for was leading the award-winning Wrapped annual campaign. Manu was also at Sony PlayStation and developed the digital marketing function across EMEA for the global entertainment brand.

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We cover:

• How Duolingo moved from a paid advertising to a social first approach
• This approach which has led to a much more significant impact to acquisition, retention, and driving the brand globally
• Focusing on developing locally relevant content
• Building a team that is nimble, resourceful, and understands the brand extremely well

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Where to find Manu:

https://www.linkedin.com/in/eorssaud/

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Where to find Patrick:

https://www.linkedin.com/in/pcmoran/

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(02:16) An intro to Duolingo and its business model

(02:57) Duolingo's mission and the problem it's trying to solve

(05:58) Science backed language proficiency framework that Duolingo uses

(07:44) Main audiences around the world

(09:19) The alternatives to Duolingo and what is specific to the experience

(13:12) Building a global brand and Duolingo's approach to this

(16:52) Learning from the community and the magic that came out of those interactions

(22:08) Driving new user growth and retention rates through social media

(24:05) The marketing mix

(26:57) Expanding the brand globally and being locally relevant

(29:39) Doing social media locally really well

(31:00) Developing specific story lines and how fast content travels

(32:59) Approach to team structure, a focus on being nimble, resourceful and understands the brand extremely well

(35:32) Where to find Manu!

Alex Birkett is a co-founder of Omniscient Digital, an organic growth agency that builds content & SEO programs for ambitious B2B brands. Previously, he worked on growth and experimentation at Workato, HubSpot, and CXL.

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We Talk About:

• Figuring out the right opportunity areas for content marketing
• Effectively using Generative AI to develop a unique POV
• Applying the barbell strategy to make bets on approaches
• Finding the next horizons of growth for content

--- We cover:

https://beomniscient.com/blog/barbell-content-strategy/

https://beomniscient.com/blog/first-steps-to-incorporate-ai-into-content-marketing/

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Where to Find Alex Birkett:

Linkedin: https://www.linkedin.com/in/iamalexbirkett/

Personal Site: https://www.alexbirkett.com/

Website: https://beomniscient.com/

The Long Game podcast: https://beomniscient.com/podcast/

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Where to Find Patrick Moran:

LinkedIn: https://www.linkedin.com/in/pcmoran/

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(02:14) Key drivers the definitions of organic growth

(04:04) Figuring out opportunity areas and goal definitions

(06:30) Common mistakes companies mistake when figuring out their content strategy

(11:16) Finding channel-product fit and leaning in on strengths

(14:15) Generate AI in content and the current use cases

(16:28) Tactical usage of Generative AI and when to use it for competitive advantages

(18:21) Maintaining authority and a unique POV with content

(19:38) Creatively molding concepts and developing foundational use cases

(20:31) How to think about measurement and effectiveness for content marketing

(22:13) Applying attribution based methods to the growth model

(26:24) Using a barbell strategy to developing a portfolio of content bets

(30:47) Evolving the portfolio over time

(34:27) Finding the next horizons of growth through the barbell strategy

(37:42) Affiliates and partnerships within the content strategy

(40:20) The differences between B2B and B2C and borrowing models from both

(42:06) Where to find Alex Birkett!

Andrew has over fifteen years of Ad and MarTech experience at eBay, Google, Meta, Netflix, Snap, and fintech startups. He has tackled hard challenges in product, strategy, growth, go-to-market, and partnerships across many verticals and geographies. He is highly strategic, and has experience building and applying buy- and sell-side ad technology at scale. He has been advising companies from start-ups to Fortune 500 enterprises since 2012.

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We talk about:

• Varying measurement methods and when to lean in on one or two of them
• How the most sophisticated advertisers use a persistent hold out
• The best way to approach media that has to run nationally
• The differences between measuring advertising and channel effectiveness and optimization impact
• The variables needed to structure effective measurement methods

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Where to find Andrew:

Andrew's LinkedIn Profile: https://www.linkedin.com/in/andrewcovato/

Growth by Science: https://www.growthbyscience.com/

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We reference:

https://www.measured.com/blog/geo-testing-series-test-design/

https://www.measured.com/blog/geo-testing-series-part-2-test-management/

https://www.measured.com/blog/geo-testing-series-part-3-analytics-and-reporting/

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Where to find Patrick:

Patrick's LinkedIn Profile: https://www.linkedin.com/in/pcmoran/

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(2:07) History of advertising and contextualizing the ideal measurement stack

(7:40) Options for measurement - Geo testing, using media mix models, time series analysis, and newer versions of multi-touch attribution

(12:55) Using a measurement tax effectively to value advertising and the consequences of using attribution

(15:16) The most effective ways to impact advertising using creatives, reach, and frequency and not playing around with bidding

(16:50) Using upper funnel metrics to inform optimization approaches

(18:54) Situations where attribution is applicable

(21:46) Budget approach required to run these tests and committing to the process to detect signal

(25:44) Approaching marketing level impact first and then measuring channel impact

(30:26) Using a constant holdout, when it works and when it doesn't work

(33:39) Simplicity and specificity when setting this up

(37:28) The three main variables on structuring a persistent hold out

(39:39) Measuring brand advertising

(45:41) Perspective on using varying look back periods

(47:56) Where to find Andrew!

Andrew is the Head of Consumer Growth at OpenStore where he leads the team responsible for managing and growing OpenStore's portfolio of Shopify brands. His team is building a proprietary stack across data, engineering, marketing and retail management.

OpenStore provides liquidity to Shopify entrepreneurs that drive at least $1M in GMV or Gross Merchandise Value. They now own or work with 40 brands and over 100K products. Prior to OpenStore, Andrew was SVP, Marketing at Grove Collaborative, where he built the Consumer Marketing team and served as a member of the executive team from Series A through IPO. He was also a VP at QuinStreet, where he incubated an email marketing business that grew to $10M in its second year, and held a variety of management & operational roles.

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We discuss:

• The tailwinds and headwinds that Shopify entrepreneurs face
• Channel make up for different types of ecommerce companies
• Factors to consider for unit economics and measurement
• Optimization levers for Google and Meta

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We cover:

OpenStore: https://open.store/

Increasing revenue for Jack Archer, a clothing brand: https://www.linkedin.com/pulse/how-openstore-increased-jack-archers-revenue-from-1m-10m-silard%3FtrackingId=S%252BASEL%252FcYp95KMwF50Te8Q%253D%253D/?trackingId=S%2BASEL%2FcYp95KMwF50Te8Q%3D%3D

Various ways to increase profitability: https://open.store/blog/best-practice-shopify-profitability-customer-support

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Where to find Andrew:

https://www.linkedin.com/in/andrewsilard/

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Where to find Patrick:

https://www.linkedin.com/in/pcmoran/

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(02:49) What's driving lower barriers to entry for starting an e-commerce store but much more difficult to scale

(06:22) The common two different models that have different channel mix complexions

(10:39) Where Wayfair started and where they've graduated to as an example of the progression of certain companies

(15:00) Having the expertise to operate efficiently given the plethora of tools out there

(16:01) How to think about unit economics, especially given VC funding levels

(20:46) Variables to consider with targeting existing users

(22:32) When creative optimization becomes the main lever

(26:40) When feed optimization is the main lever and using AI for dynamic overlays

(28:32) Google and Meta has made it easier for SMBs to play in paid, but still comes with optimization shortcomings

(29:55) Using an effective attribution model

(33:42) What OpenStore does for Shopify entrepreneurs and the direction of the company

(39:49) The challenges that comes with the interoperability of tooling

(41:51) Where to find Andrew!

Shannon Deep is a writer, brand marketer, and grown up theater kid, who has never met a craft or cat she didn't like. From freelance writing, dramaturgy, and script consulting to working at international branding agencies and global tech brands, Shannon has always put storytelling at the heart of her career. She's the co-founder of Bonfire, which helps brands and the people who build them kindle their creativity through better storytelling.

Kevan Lee is the co-founder of Bonfire. Prior to Bonfire, he led marketing teams for some of the biggest brands in tech, and he has over 15 years experience in scaling growth, brand, and impact from zero to one (and well beyond).

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We cover:

• The story structure framework and how to establish a brand
• Importance of consistency and quality
• Defining a brand's purpose
• Examples of brands that have applied story structures effectively

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We reference:

https://aroundthebonfire.com/

https://kevanlee.substack.com/p/317-story-structures-

https://kevanlee.substack.com/p/409-purpose

https://kevanlee.substack.com/p/435-storytelling-frameworks

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Where to find Shannon and Kevan:

Shannon's LinkedIn Profile: https://www.linkedin.com/in/shannon-deep-34997983/

Kevan's LinkedIn Profile: https://www.linkedin.com/in/kevanlee/

https://aroundthebonfire.substack.com/

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Where to find Patrick:

Patrick's LinkedIn Profile: https://www.linkedin.com/in/pcmoran/

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(02:34) What startups don't do in effectively developing a brand

(04:29) Implications of limited and narrow ways of brand conception with companies across all stages

(06:17) Applying a brand system through quality and consistency

(07:19) The importance of developing a consistent and compelling brand narrative

(08:39) Cases and examples of companies with consistent brand storytelling and the advantages that come with it

(11:39) Overall structure and framework of story structures at the executive level down

(13:23) The purpose as an intersection between a cultural tension your solving for and a view of your brands best self

(15:39) A strong brand purpose is longer term, inspirational and motivational and can be considered relative to what competitors are doing

(20:25) The right teams and leaders involved with developing the brand

(23:29) Crafting nuanced and multifaceted stories - category/product/persona/cultural - to apply the story structure

(27:18) Using data and insights to inform the story structures

(30:38) Sequencing and prioritizing structures and the stories that come with it

(34:06) Applying measurement and effectiveness on how stories resonate

(41:07) How these stories fit within the overall marketing strategy and deriving impact

(46:40) Applying story structures with brands

(49:26) Where to find Shannon and Kevan!

Cian is the Chief Marketing Officer at Wise, a global fintech company which solves for international money challenges for consumers and businesses. Cian was the Chief Customer Officer at Secret Escapes, a members-only travel and experiences company, working across brand, performance marketing, CRM, data science, and product. He's also spent time at The Guardian, ASOS, eBay, Lloyds Bank, and Capital One.

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We talk about:

• Building regional marketing teams
• The role of measurement in decision-making, and the relationship between marketing and finance
• Leaning into customer experiences to differentiate from a crowded space
• Why it's not advisable to apply universal playbooks

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Where to find Cian:

Cian's LinkedIn Profile: https://www.linkedin.com/in/cianw/

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Where to find Patrick:

Patrick's LinkedIn Profile: https://www.linkedin.com/in/pcmoran/

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(02:22) Introduction to Wise

(05:51) Foundations on consumer marketing and building out B2B and enterrprise marketing

(08:08) State of the European macro environment and the implications to Wise

(10:17) Product led growth and developing a solid product experience to drive more acquisition

(13:19) Ensuring marketing is a growth lever and drives causal impact

(15:48) Using a predictable LTV and fully loading costs within a 12 month payback period. Establishing profitable cohorts

(21:48) Building SEO at scale to drive organic acquisition and an owned sophisticated affiliate network to contribute to SEO traffic (wow)

(24:19 ) Leaning in on content for B2B marketing

(25:05) Regional and international organizational models

(29:54) Lifecycle marketing and CRM operations

(32:00) The CMO/CFO relationship and developing the conviction and trust around governing spend

(35:40) Establishing the brand mostly against banks

(40:53) Not believing in universal playbooks which is broken with new constraints. Focusing on first principles

(44:08) Execution is not the only thing that matters

(47:27) Sustained CMO leadership

(50:26) Where to find Cian!

Arielle picked up product marketing on the job at Google, where she helped grow Gmail in its early days. Then at Square, she was one of the first marketers who led the launch of new hardware products and distributed them to more than 30k retailers. Arielle's worked with hundreds of early stage companies — including Patreon, Loom, Front, Bowery, Eero, and Maven — on their foundational messaging as the Marketer in Residence at First Round Capital and through her own consulting practice.

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We talk about:

• Developing a positioning strategy before building
• Problem discovery and audience understanding
• Focusing on the primary audience and making sacrifices on who not to target
• What has worked and not worked

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Where to find Arielle

LinkedIn: https://www.linkedin.com/in/ariellerjackson/

X: https://twitter.com/hiiamArielle

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We reference:

Positioning is Vital to your Startup Strategy: https://review.firstround.com/Positioning-Your-Startup-is-Vital-Heres-How-to-Do-It-Right

Arielle's Brand Strategy Course on Maven: https://maven.com/arielle/startupbrandstrategy

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Where to find Patrick

LinkedIn: https://www.linkedin.com/in/pcmoran/

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(2:49) Positioning strategy is just another name for your product strategy

(5:29) Developing the positioning exercise before writing a line of code

(8:44) Sacrificing who you're not building for and being extremely focused on that

(13:30) Focusing 100% on the audience at first and uncovering competing alternatives

(18:47) Naming trends and focusing less on timeless names, tones, and brand look and feel

(26:56) Pick one key benefit and double down. Using the bar test

(30:42) When word of mouth is generated and how messaging is a pre-requisite

(32:39) Positioning time horizons for start-ups and later stage companies

(36:34) Approaching a second product

(39:22) Some of the big positioning failures over time

(43:03) When positioning worked

(44:34) Where to find Arielle!

Adam is a Growth and Product advisor, the author of the FishmanAF Newsletter and creator of the Startup Dad podcast. He’s also an executive in residence at Reforge where he leads the Growth Series and co-created the Growth Leadership program. He has been an executive at ResortPass, Imperfect Foods, Patreon and Lyft.

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We talk about:

• The components of a product strategy
• Marketing and Product partnerships within the product strategy structure
• A framework for building cross functional growth teams
• Key starting points and prioritization
• Leadership and C-team alignment

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Where to find Adam:

Linkedin: https://www.linkedin.com/in/adamjfishman

The FishmanAF Newsletter: https://www.fishmanafnewsletter.com/

Reforge: https://www.reforge.com/experts/adam-fishman

Startup Dad Podcast: https://www.startupdadpod.com/

We reference:

The Growth Leadership Program: https://www.reforge.com/courses/growth-leadership

The Growth Series: https://www.reforge.com/courses/growth-series

Centralize or Decentralize: https://www.fishmanafnewsletter.com/p/growth-teams-centralize-or-decentralize

Building a Growth Strategy: https://www.fishmanafnewsletter.com/p/how-to-build-a-growth-strategy

Where to find Patrick:

Patrick’s Linkedin Profile

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(03:17) The four components of a product strategy

(08:15) How marketing fits within the product motions and product organizes across these components

(14:14) Where things usually go wrong between marketing and product teams and ensuring alignment

(19:35) Starting with metrics alignment and incentivizing the financial objectives of the company

(26:15) Centralized and decentralized growth teams

(30:22) The make up a growth squad

(31:37) Growth squads within a GM structure

(34:50) Expanding product market fit, the marketing motions against it, and cross-selling and monetization

(37:30) Internationalization and expanding markets

(39:13) The four components of building a growth team and not copying structures of other organizations

(44:38) Starting small with one team focused on a key area in the growth model

(46:44) The most common starting points, activation and monetization

(48:15) Prioritizing team profiles and going in on centralized v decentralized areas

(53:33) Aligning with the executive team

(56:08) Where to find Adam!